It's hard to make a good/fun game [Discussion]

fotogeluid

  • Posts: 271
Well i made 3 games so far. Beginners don't make super good games...thats normal..people need to learn but....

Less than 15 game plays in total for the 3 games/day. This tells me 1 thing. My games are not bad...they are worse than bad.

I think it is mainly because i am probably the worst graphic artist on the entire planet.

Do you guys agree. Maybe i better abandon the idea of making games and dedicate all my time in learning to draw....

« Last Edit: February 14, 2012, 09:38:00 pm by Jon »

GwefTech

  • Posts: 306
Do you guys agree. Maybe i better abandon the idea of making games and dedicate all my time in learning to draw....

I don't think you should just give up developing games up because you think that your graphics/art is bad.   

You might find it better to find an artist, work out a deal with him/her (in terms of $$),  let them do the art, and you do the code. 

Or if  you have enough time on your hands,  find some tutorials on photoshop/illustrator/inkscape etc.... then when your happy with the art you got, stick them in the game.

Don't just give up (unless you really want to).
## Mike
Picsel28 (formerly GwefTech)
Website - http://www.picsel28.cymru/ 
Twitter - http://www.twitter.com/mikejones89  +  http://www.twitter.com/Picsel28

1MrPaul1

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  • Posts: 1268
If you don't have artists skills, try next. Find some photo editing app, better photoshop, but also you can use free ones. Than search for some free photos in the net. And just learn how to cut it in the photoediting software. You will get interesting graphics, try to make it full trash. Something not usuall. Or you can use populare style, baby drawings, this kind of graphics you can make easy in any soft for painting.
Just remember most important rule of artist. If you start to make something, put all your soul in this work. Because, in fact, people(art customers) do not needs superbuper art or extra complex gameplay(in games) or super beauty voice(in songs). People just need to feel soul of artist in any art.
 So, put whole your soul in your game, live by this games and your game will have a chance to became populare.

rob1221

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  • Posts: 9424
Your game "Is she worth the cheese" has about 1900 plays on this site alone; where are you getting 15 plays per day from?  You're right that beginners don't make super good games, but over time their skills become better and so do their games.

fotogeluid

  • Posts: 271
1900 plays...well thats when the game is new. It has hardly any plays now....

Alexin

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  • Posts: 3132
You learned one of things anyone should know before making a good game: making a good game is hard. It requires effort and passion, other skills should come along.
"Find the fun"
alexin@stencyl.com

Aasimar

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  • Posts: 605
I think that a good game begins by a good concept, if you have a good concept, make it without visuals.
When your game seems to be like you want it, you may search a graphic designer interested by collaboration.

I'm graphic artist and level designer in a videogame studio, I'm just a crap in animations, so I found an animator, if not, the game can't be good, I know this.

I'm a crap in music, I found a sound designer! it's like that!

It's really hard to be good in all domains, Stencyl offers to you the chance to make code easier, you may use it and find a collaboration, I think it's very important to share and learn from others when you make a game.

Good luck dude, not giving up! Find the fun!

Hectate

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  • Posts: 4643
Besides all the above - I make games for me. I make games because I enjoy making games, not because I anticipate other people will enjoy playing them (though I hope that they do at least). After that it's all gravy!
:
:
Patience is a Virtue,
But Haste is my Life.
Proud member of the League of Idiotic Stencylers; doing things in Stencyl that probably shouldn't be done.

damijin

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  • Posts: 70
What an excellent thread!

This ties in really well with what I was just reading on Penny Arcade about the amazing Doublefine Kickstarter campaign:

Quote
It’s been my experience that making games is essentially impossible, an act which struggles and scrapes against an invisible but universal law.  There’s “sausage making,” which is generally considered something people don’t want to see, but creating games is the act of making sausage out of yourself, which is probably worse.  I expect slash demand long, silent shots of a comatose Tim Schafer, his viscera spooling into a device of Venusian origin.

Indeed making a game is essentially impossible. The fact that you made and released a game at all puts you above so many millions of gamers who say to their friends "UGH THIS GAME IS CRAP. I COULD MAKE A BETTER GAME THAN THIS." and then go back to their jobs at Burger King to make minimum wage.

Don't stop making games. Don't stop criticizing yourself or others. Keep improving. After 10 years, your games will start to reach the level of "good" and in another 30, if you really have the passion, you'll start approaching the word "great".

But if your heart isn't in it -- chase whatever your heart IS in. It's your life. Make whatever you want to make with the time you have.


Strasteo

  • Posts: 322
One thing that I value a lot is some advice my own father gave to me.

"I'd rather you pursue something that is difficult and which you have a passion for than doing something easy that you don't care for."

Yes, it is hard to make good games. The same can be said for anything, really. It takes practice, and with games, if you're making it yourself, it can take even longer since you're essentially taking on roles of game designer, tester, programmer, etc. If you look at game credits for commercial games, the number of people involved is staggering, and you're trying to do all that by yourself, or with two or three people.

This doesn't mean you should give up. If this is something you love to do, then stick by it. Those who don't have the drive or passion shouldn't pursue it, and should seek something that they really do enjoy. We'll all have times when we feel like no one finds our work great, or we don't feel successful. Sometimes it's just bad luck. Maybe the time the game released wasn't the best, maybe the audience wasn't right... it's a finicky, complex business. Don't be ashamed if it didn't go well the first, second, or third time. Use these experiences to become better and aim higher.

Basically my thoughts on this.

Silux

  • Posts: 438
Number of plays depends from the lenght of the game, the replayability, the multiplayer factor, the advertising and the perceived update rate.
It doesn't depends directly by the art or by the game being uber-funny.

If the game is funny player will post jokes and good comment, rate it good and tell to others.
Currently working at:
Starwarrior 2097(my main project)
How to make successful games in Kongregate and the world(article)

thechaosengine

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  • Posts: 329
Making games is ridiculously hard, but it also has to be. Think about it:

There are people who study and work for years to become good programmers.
There are people who study and work for years to become good artists.
There are people who study and work for years to become good UI designers.
There are people who study and work for years to become good animators.
There are people who study and work for years to become good musicians.
There are people who study and work for years to become good sound FX artists.

As game designers, we have to be ALL THOSE THINGS AT ONCE! And yeah you can outsource or straight up neglect many of those aspects, but in the end you're still responsible for them.

So you know what, fotogeluid? You are awesome. Don't give up.


fotogeluid

  • Posts: 271
"  You are awesome. "  :o

Wow thanks dude.

I am currently working on another game. This game will have amazing graphics. All self made...

This game will kick ass. I am going to shock and let the world see what a noob can do with the power of stencyl..... :D


NexusxAlpha

  • Posts: 157
I am sorta the same, I am terrible at graphics, but I *think* I'm quite good with other things like logic and offering creative input, sorting out the bugs I can. One of the reasons I quit my job was to work on games (I also left because of the people there, they are idiots). People may think it might have been a wrong choice, but I have a burning passion for game development, I think about games from the minute I wake and when I'm going to bed.

First you need to avoid the "it's too hard" and the "i cant do that" because the second you think like that, the game(s) you're working on will make you depressed cause you think they wont get finished and you'll end up leaving the game alone.

If you want to make "good" graphics, spend some money on some grid paper like this: http://www.ricksmath.com/images/graphpaper2.gif but obviously in paper form. Once you get that, imagine that paper is the screen, and the squares are the pixels. This is what I've been doing for a while and have came up with many ideas for games and graphics.

Using that grid paper is like a cheat way to make good pixel art, seriously you can get really good with it and once you're comfortable with the larger grid paper, get one that has smaller grid segments on it so you can keep refining, then see if there are even smaller ones until there is nothing small enough, then grab yourself some paper and draw on that.

You might not become an artist but it helped me from drawing stick men to drawing crappy dragons, but as I kept drawing I developed my own art style using shadows as the main source of detail.

My conclusion is, don't give up if you want to make games, because you may regret it later down the line. And don't let the aspect of "time" bring you down either, it can take a long time to get used to anything and even more so in all aspects of game design.

Nexus

mkenyon

  • Posts: 7
This is a good thread, I'm going to send it to a couple of my game students. Fotogeluid take a look at these guys (http://www.sharkarmstudios.com/) their fist games were much like your first efforts. But after working a lot on drawing and coding they really improved.